First American Title Incompetence

Since when do you need to be fingerprinted to own property? Is that a California thing?

Yeah, it's amazing what they can get you to sign for when they dangle a house in front of you. I guess they assume that people won't worry too much about a two-figure expense when they're buying a six-figure house.

Mine wasn't too bad. No fingerprinting at least!

Fingerprinting? That's a new one (as in I didn't have to do it when I got my house two years ago). Well, that or my title company screwed that up too and just used someone else's.

Are you sure that some piece of paperwork doesn't list you as "Jeremy al Zawondny"?

(Or they realized that you co-wrote a book with Derek and figured that put you into a completely different category. Thank God orkut came out AFTER i got my house.)

I had a similar problem when buying a house only in my case the mortgage company screwed the whole thing up rather than the title company (Commonwealth which were very good and didn't nickle and dime me at all). The mortagage guy:

1) Screwed up the number of points we were paying but with the correct interest rate on all the documents (so we had to go to do the signoff twice).

2) Got the wrong closing date so our rate lock ended up expiring two days before closing! At least they funded the loan at the rate lock but all of sudden several days interest needed to be paid and the bastard (who eventually reimbursed me) didn't call me!

As I said before, incompetance is something you really have to be on the lookout for. It really is like this is the first mortgage they've ever done. At least in Santa Clara country, my understanding was the sellar picks the title company so it's not like you have a choice in the matter.

I had to give a thumbprint (which begat the usual question "what if you don't have thumb") -- I think it is a california thing. The whole thing is so surreal anyway that having your thumbprint taken doesn't seem like a big deal at that point.

Anyway, it sounds like you are pretty close, so congratulatons!

Congrats on your house! (that is the most important thing).

I was lucky with my title company, but it was my cousin's company. Washington Mutual has been good for me so far.

I love it when people use blogs as a form of consumer activism. I hope people looking for a title company see your post.

-Jackson

As a realtor, I am very sorry to hear that you had such a bad experience. Home buying can be difficult at times, but that is why you had a realtor represent you and supervise third party (escrow) involvment in your transaction. It sounds as if she did the best she could, but was not able to review the final signing package before you got there. I find that by supervising the escrow officer's handling of the lender's requirements, getting there early to review their numbers and by providing the right mortgage for my clients in the first place, problems like this are virtually eliminated. Another thing to remember is that title companies have cut back staff since the refi boom ended and therby often overwork their escrow officers. Call me if you ever need an opinion on real estate or mortgage matters,(408)370-1020,105.

First American has a swank humongous building near where I work just off the I-55 in Tustin/Santa Ana. Having closed 4 mortgages with them in 4 years (two homes) I always have a pride of ownership when I drive past knowing that my money for their (lack of) service helped pay for their early American style bungalow.

If you just left it to the mortgage brokers, real estate agents, inspectors, and escrow people without double checking everything nothing would get done correctly. And it is so very annoying that "professionals" are so sloppy.

And this one just acknowledges that you had received the previous docuemnt... sign here..

And this one acknowledges your signature acknowleging your acceptance of the previous document prior to the previous document... sign here...

And this one states that if you decide to eat the paint off the floorboards and happen to get lead poisoning, you will aknowledge your own stupidity and not the stupidity of the previous owner for using illegally obtained lead-based paint on a dwelling built after 1979... sign here...

And this document ....

BTDT

Right thumbprint is required when notarizing deeds (including deed of trust) in California.

I've found mobile notaries to be better at catching things than signing at the title company.

Congrats!

I have read all of this and cannot believe the ignorance of the average citizen purchasing a home. I used to be in escrow years ago before the thumbprint for the notary was in use. It is there because a great deal of these all importance pumped up men purchasing a home out there were actually using another person other than their wife to sign the papers. All of the documents you are finding are because earlier some all important stiff like yourself ripped someone off. Usually when it involves escrow it is not a $10.00 fee. I actually had a guy bring me flowers and candy for weeks before closing and then give me a check for $80,000.00 that was bogus. He never made the check good and fortunately it was caught before we closed the escrow.

As for your bad experience with FATCO back in February, I completely understand, but from a different point of view. I am a former employee. Having a brain while working there is not in your best interest as it will cause you much pain and suffering while having to endure their incompetant "management" style. The center I worked with was run by a female micro-managing bully who surrounded herself with other female micro-managing bullies or with weak yes-women that were easy to control with threats and belittling comments. That is also how we employees were treated: with threats and bullying. If you didn't work the sometimes 12 hours a day that were required you weren't a "team player" There were constant reorganizations, people were constantly getting moved around (or would suddenly disappear with an email stating such and such is no longer employed at FATCO) and the training was terrible. In your best interest at staying employed there you had to learn quickly with as little training as possible because the people who actually know what they are doing are extremely overworked. You had to learn by all the mistakes you made (example not revising a HUD with incorrect closing figures, sound familiar?) There were no guidelines for procedures so the training was all word of mouth. And why would you want to train someone to learn your job properly? If they did it better than you, you might become the next person that no longer works at FATCO. But for me the game is over, my department got downsized due to the fact interest rates are going up.
Whew! I feel better. Thanks for giving me the opportunity to vent!

First American Title in Del Norte County is incompetent. It is just unbelievable how they expect you to do their work for them as they collect incredible fees.
So, what is next? Before selling, search other Title Companies, demand they put in writing what they will do for x dollars and when they will have the preliminary documents ready for your review. A favorite trick is to put off everything till the last moment and then you get to run around and solve everything. Never again with First American Title. Never.
PnB

Call me. I'll Notarize it! San Diego. 760.505.0636 Mobile Notary No Hassles!

Interesting comments from all regarding the experience you received from my employer First American Title Company.
I'd be curious to learn when they (escrow) received the Lenders Documents prior to your appointment to sign. More often than not the lender chosen by the consumer (or their r. e. agent, or the internet....) has a loan processing time of 45 - 90 days to get everything together. Then they (the lender) email/fax/carrier pigeon their instructions, which dictate conditions of your loan, to escrow 5 minutes before or 20 minutes after you appear at escrow to sign docs. Naturally, escrow's ability to perform is compressed into .0009 miliseconds. For this treatment from your lender you pay "points, warehousing fees, doc prep, underwriting, loan origination, yield spread premiums, processing, admin fees, broker fees," etc. etc.
I don't claim FATCO walks on water. We have our failings but address them better than any other title firm out there. I say this having been in the industry for 19 years and having worked for my competition. Your experience also points out the enormous value of having a good real estate agent represent you in such a transaction.
Glad your deal closed properly and I trust you are enjoying your new home.

we dealt with FATCO in San Bernardino, CA. Thanks to their incompetence we almost lost our home because they screwed up the pay off. we had and were expected to pay on two open first liens. It ended up costing us several thousands in the long run and a scarred credit report.

you guy's are right professional's never make mistakes

I am involved in a Real Estate Transaction with First American Title Being the Title Company. It has been kind of a complicated deal, however, I have worked in the Title Insurance business for many years so I knew it would happen there were just a lot of details to cover. In trying to keep up with what was going on as far as the status of our commitment being updated and so forth, I spoke with the examiner working on our file. I tried to reach our closing officer however, she was at lunch so I just contacted the examiner working on our file to find out if our updated commitment was ready to send to the attorney in order for them to prepare the documents. She told me it was ready and she would have it out that day. The next thing I know is that the closing officer is calling me screaming at me like a crazy person for talking to the examiner. She continued to scream and yell at me and told me she had a stack of documents that had just come in on the deal and the examiner didn't know she had them. So, I'm trying to figure out why this woman is screaming at me like I am one of her children. To make a long story short...my husband ended up calling this closing officer back and letting her know he didn't appreciate her screaming at his wife. He was in the same room when I was talking to her and could hear her screaming. He also asked her what other documents she had received and she finally admitted she didn't have any additional documents...So why was she so angry that I spoke with the examiner. I guess we'll never know. We had our transaction moved from that closing officers branch to another one close to us so we wouldn't have to deal with her. What a nightmare. I called the President of First American Title to report this incident.

all you incompetent people complaining about document's that are prepared by the lender

I have eight years experience in the Title Insurance field. Some of your complaints are valid. Some are not. All of those redundant documents you are complaining about are lender docs sent to the title company by the lender(probably 5 minute before closing). The other documents are real estate docs required to complete a closing. If you sell a home you have far less to sign because you don't sign any lender documents. Your closer was most likely new. The problems you experienced were the result of one person not having the experience to deal with issues that come up in a closings that were easily fixed. Also, your lender will hit you with fees far more extensive than any title company. Your loan officer probably made about $2000 dollars for about one hour of work and your real estate agent walked away with thousands of dollars. Please give people that are new at there job a little bit of a break and do some research about the fees and costs associate with buying a home.

I closed on a loan with American Land Title in South Burlington, VT on June 16, 2003. 7 months later they call me to tell me that they erroniously gave us $5060.00 too much money and I need to pay it back. Yeah right like I didn't tell those people that the figure was wrong. They assured me that it was right.
Of course the money went into the house we are building, it's not like we flew to Europe on it.

Now they are suing us and will probably put a lien on the house.

I just mention this so you know that it could have been worse for you. Enjoy your house!

Sounds like you should have taken issue with your lender, it's the lender's responsibility to get all necessary docs required for the loan!
The lender then sends everything to title with instructions.

The phrase "IGNORANCE IS BLISS" comes to mind when reading the original complaint. As for this complaint....it sounds like a spoiled person who has his meat cut for him. I am in the business and understand that mistakes happen in life(except with Jeremy) and it's not the end of the world unless you're a Title Company I guess, but you don't know the behind the scenes CRAP that Title Companies have to put up with......Pushy Real Estate Agents who think that they are the only ones alive, ignorant Principals who need their asses wiped for them and Lenders/Brokers that think (most of the time) all Title Companies need is about 5 minutes to pull everything together before you come in to sign all of THEIR document's. Let me see, you probably had about 1 to 3 document's to sign that was required by your Title Company and the rest of the billion (redundent) document's were from your LENDER, which was not Fatco...it was Wamu. As for showing you where to sign...it's not that obvious to most, about 90% of Rocket Scientist Buyers don't even insert the date which is clearly stated right after your fabulous signature line...I personally highlight every place that needs to be signed...otherwise, it would hold up your whole closing if YOU missed something, then you would have something else to blame on Fatco! Did anyone from Wamu call you and discuss how many of THEIR document's you would have to sign OR tell you to call them if you didn't understand them OR let you know that THEIR Deed of Trust and probably numerous other document's require Notarization, and also requires a thumbprint (consult your Secretary of State website, it might shine some light into that dark phasm you call a brain). I'm thinking that the answer to all of those questions is a big fat NO! Sounds like it was up to the Title Company to retrieve a paystub or a final HUD from the sale of a home or a letter, etc....these are all items that should be handled by your Broker or your Lender (who is probably making just as much as your Title Company, check the figures!)....and sounds like your Lender should have informed you of these additional requirements ahead of time so you could have been prepared to hand them to the incompetent retards at Fatco. I will inform the President of my company that we now need to employ "Hand Holders" and "Butt Wipers" for our buyers and sellers so they don't have to think for themselves and also fire that damn Secretary of State who requires those awful Notaries and finger printing....OOH....won't go over good with GW now that we have that "Patriot Act" in tact though...personally, I trust everybody to be honest....don't you?....who need's notaries...or the Border Patrols or the Military!! One more thing...it probably took 2 minutes to print up a new statement of closing cost's for you to sign and with no more cost to you...not really a cause for a Blog uproar. I ask you this...where was the follow up with your Lender and/or Broker who are the entities requiring this additional documentation??...could they have given you a quick call?? Oh, I forget, it's up to the Title Company to do EVERYTHING. WHAH TO YOU!!!

FATCO! Let me tell you. These people out of the Riverside FATCO office are completly ..... Let me tell you a short story. I sold my house I used FATCO for the title company and closed. Sounds Good right? Guess again. 8 months after closing I get a Bill in the mail for $2600.00. I call FATCO and they tell me this is a Clerical error and to disregard it that they will fix the problem. 6 months after the first letter I got Supenoed to show up in court. I was being sued by FATCO for $2500.00. So I call and ask why they are sueing me Ready... They forgot to pay back taxes on the property. I had no idea of these taxes and Thus the reason I paid FATCO to find them. So I go to court and the Judge (Cass Waters out of Riverside) Rules that FATCO is owed the Money even though I paid them $981 to clear the title (which they did at closing). In court FATCO produces a document that showed they did know about the taxes and just forgot to charge me. I ask does anyone find this odd? Is this not the job of the title comapany and isn't that what the insurance is for?

I stumbled on this blog when doing a search for FATCO so I could get an address to send a complaint to. We bought a house last April with FATCO being the title company. A week ago I got a call from a credit collector informing me there is a lein on our home! This dates back to a previous owner who was foreclosed on before the owner we bought the house from! There is a $2200 judgment and when the house was foreclosed on, this creditor was never notified, so apparently the judgment is still valid.
Since I have title insurance, I figure I'm covered and call FATCO, who inform me that indeed I AM covered and will not have to pay this, BUT they refuse to take any action unless or until the leinholder attempts to foreclose on us! WHAT???? I spoke to the leinholder and he laughed and said they'd just sit on it and let it accrue interest until we're ready to sell or refinance!
Can FATCO really DO this? Just sit on it and hope it goes away? My husband and I are actually considering refinancing right now because rates have dropped, but this will screw it up... or at least delay it which could affect our interest rate.
Don't I have some recourse? FATCO researched our title and assured us everything was fine, as well as insuring us if they missed any leins they would be responsible for covering them. Does anyone have any suggestions on how to force them to comply?
So far, I've been informed by my agent at FATCO that they won't even talk to the leinholder.
help.

I like this blog for many reasons, one is that everybody get's to release some frustration and hopefully get some help. I understand both sides of the last 2 post's....There is no simple answer unless you have an attorney involved(which nobody want's to pay for)In the matter of "Jerry", Taxes are the sole responsibility of the owner of the property and if you don't pay your taxes, you will pay more in the end. YES, the Title Co. should have required you to pay the taxes through the escrow but the fact of the matter is, it was your responsibility to pay those taxes PERIOD. The insurance has nothing to do with taxes, it's a lien from the state in which you live and is an "EXCEPTION" of any policy! Now, the matter of "Carol", if the lien was recorded at the county on which the property exists and it was recorded BEFORE the close of escrow date, it is the responsibilty of the title co. to research it. In the matter of a foreclosure, the previous owner does not even own the property at time of sale, it's the bank that foreclosed, so there is some responsibility of the bank as well!!I think you might actually have to get an attorney and compile as much info as you can, ie, Title Policy, Grant Deed, Closing Statement, lender info for your bank...because they would love to know that they are not in FIRST LIEN POSITION. The first step is to contact the "Chief Title Officer" of that First American branch and if that get's you nowhere, contact the Sant Ana, CA headquarters and ask for the owner. The key is to know when that lien recorded(get a copy of it) and if everything was correct on it(such as property address, parcel number, county, etc.). Good Luck! Just remember that even though you are provided a Title Policy, it doesn't mean you have washed your hands of responsibility.

FATCO in Washington State is incompetent too! So glad to know I am not alone. I found this blog while hate-mongering FATCO. I have bought a few houses in my lifetime and refinanced a few times, so I am a little familiar with the process. Usually we go through a different title company and have no major problems, bearing in mind that humans sometime make mistakes. But FATCO takes the cake. First, a few days before we were going to close, we called to give them the heads up and try to make an appointment. They blew us off. Our other title company would schedule tentative appts for closing (as long as all the paperwork was ready). Then, on the day before closing they call in a panic and tell us we MUST come in right then and there to sign all the paperwork or we won't close on time. With three kids in the height of little league season, there was no way we could. They ended up having to stay open until 8 p.m. so we could get in there to sign. There were lots of mistakes and typos. The gal that was helping us didn't know a thing about what she was doing. Luckily this was not our first home-buying experience. A few weeks later we get a real estate tax statement in the mail. We have always had taxes come out of the escrow acct and usually the tax statement we receive says "This is not a bill." However, this particular one WAS a bill due Oct 31. We looked through our closing documents but weren't 100% sure what the deal was, so we called FATCO. FATCO said it was correct. It was a bill. We have to pay. We just figured our the lender didn't take the taxes out of escrow to keep the monthly payments below a certain level. October rolls around and we pay the bill. Just to be sure, husband calls our lender who we have known for a few years now. She says no, the taxes were paid out of escrow. Who knows what FATCO did wrong. I know it was their error because their name was also on the paperwork sent, not our lender. Because the county received our check before they received the escrow check, they cashed ours. Now to get a refund, we have been waiting for the county to refund the lender, who will then put it in our escrow acct. Then we have to request an audit of our escrow acct. If there is more than $50 extra in there, they will send us a refund. As of this date, the lender has not even received a refund from the county, who says they already sent it. Sigh. It sure would be nice to have that money before the holidays. In the end, I suppose it is our fault for believing FATCO and not triple checking. I will never use them again.

Carol--

Ironically, the cheapest answer to your problem is ironic. DO proceed with your refinance, and be sure to use First American--BECAUSE now that they are alerted to the problem, they will have to pay the lien in order for your transaction to close. The new Preliminary Title Report they issue to your lender will have to disclose the lien (which of course they have now corrected their title records to be aware of). The lender's instructions will require that it be paid off. Since you have insurance not showing the lien, just refer your Escrow Officer to the previous transaction number, and they will have to obtain a Release for the lien by paying it off so your loan can close. They will do it promptly because they won't want you to sue them for actual damages by your potentially having to lose a favorable interest rate (rates are inching up!).Since Title Companies are afraid of legal expenses more than most claims because they must shoulder all that expense, whatever it is,in addition to the claim while they fight it in court, most title companies-- and particuarly First American-- will be quick to write a check to the lienholder to stop the 'leak' of real or potential attorneys fees.

I offer this as someone who used to manage one of their offices, and I know how 'corporate' thinks. There are good and bad title company offices of all brands all over the place; First American's weakness is that it is so bent on being #1 globally that they worry about business volume more than people. If you are feeling 'processed' after going there, it is because corporate culture is so bent on being #1 globally that they value business volume more than customer satisfaction; the quotas they place on their highly paid Escrow Officers are enormous.

The remedy? Avoid that culture by using a local independent title company whenever possible. If they make a mistake, they really feel it locally and they will likely be much more responsive when something goes wrong. Good training is more a function of survival there; it will always be so.

Good luck!

Carol--

Ironically, the cheapest answer to your problem is ironic. DO proceed with your refinance, and be sure to use First American--BECAUSE now that they are alerted to the problem, they will have to pay the lien in order for your transaction to close. The new Preliminary Title Report they issue to your lender will have to disclose the lien (which of course they have now corrected their title records to be aware of). The lender's instructions will require that it be paid off. Since you have insurance not showing the lien, just refer your Escrow Officer to the previous transaction number, and they will have to obtain a Release for the lien by paying it off so your loan can close. They will do it promptly because they won't want you to sue them for actual damages by your potentially having to lose a favorable interest rate (rates are inching up!).Since Title Companies are afraid of legal expenses more than most claims because they must shoulder all that expense, whatever it is,in addition to the claim while they fight it in court, most title companies-- and particuarly First American-- will be quick to write a check to the lienholder to stop the 'leak' of real or potential attorneys fees.

I offer this as someone who used to manage one of their offices, and I know how 'corporate' thinks. There are good and bad title company offices of all brands all over the place; First American's weakness is that it is so bent on being #1 globally that they worry about business volume more than people. If you are feeling 'processed' after going there, it is because corporate culture is so bent on being #1 globally that they value business volume more than customer satisfaction; the quotas they place on their highly paid Escrow Officers are enormous.

The remedy? Avoid that culture by using a local independent title company whenever possible. If they make a mistake, they really feel it locally and they will likely be much more responsive when something goes wrong. Good training is more a function of survival there; it will always be so.

Good luck!

Carol--

Ironically, the cheapest answer to your problem is ironic. DO proceed with your refinance, and be sure to use First American--BECAUSE now that they are alerted to the problem, they will have to pay the lien in order for your transaction to close. The new Preliminary Title Report they issue to your lender will have to disclose the lien (which of course they have now corrected their title records to be aware of). The lender's instructions will require that it be paid off. Since you have insurance not showing the lien, just refer your Escrow Officer to the previous transaction number, and they will have to obtain a Release for the lien by paying it off so your loan can close. They will do it promptly because they won't want you to sue them for actual damages by your potentially having to lose a favorable interest rate (rates are inching up!).Since Title Companies are afraid of legal expenses more than most claims because they must shoulder all that expense, whatever it is,in addition to the claim while they fight it in court, most title companies-- and particuarly First American-- will be quick to write a check to the lienholder to stop the 'leak' of real or potential attorneys fees.

I offer this as someone who used to manage one of their offices, and I know how 'corporate' thinks. There are good and bad title company offices of all brands all over the place; First American's weakness is that it is so bent on being #1 globally that they worry about business volume more than people. If you are feeling 'processed' after going there, it is because corporate culture is so bent on being #1 globally that they value business volume more than customer satisfaction; the quotas they place on their highly paid Escrow Officers are enormous.

The remedy? Avoid that culture by using a local independent title company whenever possible. If they make a mistake, they really feel it locally and they will likely be much more responsive when something goes wrong. Good training is more a function of survival there; it will always be so.

Good luck!

we recently sold our house and bought a new one-we are using FATCO for both properties. our loan officer (through our agent) told us that we will close escrow on both properties on the same day which was convenient for us since we don't have to rent a storage. anyway, after coordinating the transfer of utility services for both properties, hiring a moving company and moving before the expiration of the interest lock, our agent calls us 2 days before the big move to say that our buyer's loan documents have to be redrawn due to some typo error and that we might close after our interest rate lock expires. and to make the matter worse, our mover wants to charge us $160 for changing moving date. our loan officer, her assistant and all the numerous people working for FATCO failed to see the disrepancy. now, we have to pay the moving company $160 for changing the moving date and probably pay additional points to extend the rate lock.

I actually had a great experience with my closing last month. I bought a house in Houston and my Realtor directed me to use AmeriPoint Title as the title company. These guys publish all of the closing documents in advance on there website (they call it ClosingSite). In addition to publishing the documents, their site allowed me to email and fax the documents to people that I wanted to see them. I was actually able to fax the draft closing papers to my father using AmeriPoint's website.

I can't believe that a site like AmeriPoint's is not standard in the title/escrow industry, but it should be. I recommend doing your homework ahead of time and choose a title company that has documents available via the web because getting your title officer on the phone at the end of the month is nearly impossible.

I just have a brief comment on your experience with First American Title. First off, people do make mistakes (and suprise, not just First American Title Company) and most reputable businesses will fix immediately. I'm assuming you brought this up to a manager?

The other thing to remember is that escrow is a third party to this transaction. Your realtor is generally making a hefty commission and should also catch these things as well as the lender. There is also a reason the escrow company issues an ESTIMATED closing statement with all of your charges. It is also your job as the consumer to make sure you look over things carefully and don't assume that has been done.

Problems with fingerprinting? Ever hear of a little thing called fraud? This annoying little requirement would prevent anyone other than yourself from selling your own home from right out in front of you.

And as far as going over each document one by one, that is for your protection. As doldrum as it sounds, reading through each one carefully (notice a pattern) makes sure you don't miss any documents. There are many times where a customer has missed a document rushing and will then have to come back (quite an inconvenience) to sign it before their lender can fund.

I too hope that others read your e-mail so they understand that this is a process and a very important one at that. One should take some responsibility for their own as this is generally the largest investment a person will ever make in their lifetime. It's your house, your responsibility. We go to the doctor too, but we must take care of our own selves too.

Thank you everyone for the heads up about FATCO. That being said, anyone have a recommendation for a good and reputable title company in addition to AmeriPoint? Does AmeriPoint Title only operate in Texas or can we use them in Nevada?

I work for first american title, and although this is old. You sure seem to complain a lot about a process that you know nothing about. Boohoohoo...life is so hard when you're required to pay for services, especially ones that are designed to protect you.

I work for First American Title on the other side of the country. I can't say that your experience mirrors the experiences of customers over here. I would also say that a single agent of FAT shouldn't taint your opinion of the whole company.

I recently closed my own home through the company, in/out 30 min with no problems. Sorry you had a bad experience.

Just another short story:

We were closing on a complicated deal--exchange AND reverse exchange into one replacement property--and so had many, many documents to sign over the course of the escrow.

Where we live, there is no mail delivery to our house, so we have a PO box. But as everyone with a PO box, or anyone who ever has to use a delivery service, knows, delivery services CANNOT deliver to PO boxes--they need a street address.

How hard is it to send US Mail to a PO Box, and things delivered by other services (FedEx, UPS, etc.) to a street address? Too hard for FATCO! They routinely send FedEx to our PO Box and occasionally mail to our PO Box. EVERY TIME, I pointed out to them: mail to PO box, everything else to street address. They could NOT get it.

Disclaimer: I work for a title insurance company but I'm one of the computer folks. I'm not a people person. =)

In most states all a closer can do is read you the name of the document, clarify any problems you might have with *reading* the document, and show you where to sign. To do otherwise is known as practicing law. Since most closers make less than lawyers, they point and smile. If you attempt to *explain* what a document is or why it's necessary, you're in trouble. I know of one specific case in my company where the closer in question was warned about explaining an APR.

As well there are quite a few people in the world who still can't read, don't use English for their first or second language, or can't see well enough to read the fine print on those documents.

Second thing to bear in mind is that the lenders almost *always* wait until the last second to get stuff done. The loan officer will wait until the end of the month until he starts pushing a deal to close because that's when his paycheck comes -- every deal he closes increases his commission. So now he has 30 to 40 deals to close instead of 4 or 5 a week and now he's giving crap attention to any of them.

The document preparation companies are usually separate from the lenders. The lender transmits information to them, they produce an electronic set of documents which can be produced at the title company's office, and the title company is responsible for printing them. That's a great process except that 1) minor changes require replacement of the entire package in a lot of cases; 2) the delivery systems used by the "docprep" companies are primitive and unreliable, even in today's world; 3) the lender doesn't even attempt to balance your HUD until fifteen minutes prior to closing when they have to send their numbers to the funding department.

The same "end of month cram it all in" mentality is what causes problems like your missing documents. The title company (and I can't say FATCO is the only one that does this, we all do) probably had (number of closers) x 8 x 4 closings scheduled for that day. Warehousing the package (making a copy for you and a copy for the lender) inevitably involves a huge stack of paper or two, a copy machine (which rarely works right), and a frustrated closer who's being told by his/her manager that they need to prepare the JOHN DOE closing because he's here and it's scheduled for 5 minutes.

All in all it's a complete bogus industry that needs to slow down and move more folks off the commission line. If you think your experience was bad you should see some that I've had the pleasure of sorting out after the lender and our closers had screwed it up. Not pretty.

I closed my own loan. Yea, there was a person sitting there (can't notarize my own documents, and my lender wouldn't have liked it if I did everything myself) but I made sure everything was in the right place, the numbers on the HUD were right, etc. Worked out well for me -- I know it's not an option for you.

The fingerprint is for fraud protection, and could be said to be a notary requirement, not a title company requirement. The notary is responsible for any identity fraud that she notarizes, so she's going to want as much information as she wants on you. She's bonded, sure, but most bonds are for $10,000.00 -- and in the case of a real estate deal that doesn't go far.

Fraud is one of the largest issues that we, as an industry, face. And we often have people getting angry at us for demanding things that we have to have in order to ensure that everything is going the way it should. Yes, we *do* need your taxes to send to your lender.

Oh, for the overpayment mentioned above. In all likelihood you signed a document during your closing that stated that you would be responsible for all over or underpayments. This is because mistakes do happen -- so the title company wants to limit their losses. Many title companies just eat the mistakes. How much does it cost to sue you for $2600? Others will pursue them.

If you told them the figures were wrong, you believed they were wrong, but you signed anyway, well, you should've known something was going to come back and bite you.

I am a closer in a title company in Oklahoma. I'm sorry that you had a terrible experience with FATCO.
Please remember that not all closing companies operate the way that I have read in the comments.
Title companies are at the mercy at times of the lenders, realtors, principals, and any one else with an interest in the transaction.
I will not schedule a closing until all title requirements are satisfied. This avoids problems like waiting moving vans, etc. I refuse to accept documents less than 24 hours in advance of the closing. This gives everyone time to get it right the first time. I insist that HUD is reviewed and approved by everyone BEFORE the closing. What are faxes machines for? While there are many documents to sign from the lender, generally closings do not take very long at all!
The difference is standing up for yourself and your customers!

today's DENVER POST has an article that state of CO has gotten First American Title Company to settle claims of fraud (kickbacks to realtors, builders and real estate agents)for $24 million.

cannot tell if this settlement is only for home sales in CO, but you can find documentation thru Google, as i found your blog.

since i closed two sales in NM with these schmucks, i am waiting to see if this is national or only for CO home sales.

zigy kaluzny
boulder CO 303/440-4850

I have been in the title business for 36 years. It has become a complex and unforgiving world. First American has thousand's of employees, who don't deserve this lynch mob treatment. It is unfortunate, that our society has evolved into a gang of thugs looking for the negative, rather than the positive in people.

Your problem seems to be the rush of the last minute arrival of the lender doc's. The poor closer has multiple persons or individuals with self serving motives rushing and pressurizing her. The funding lender, the lending broker, the processor, the listing agent, the selling agent, the buyer, the seller of the seller’s replacement home and the agents connected with that deal. This transaction suddenly becomes the domino for a multiple of other transactions pending filled with individual agenda's and demands on this one closer. Of course, don't forget those professionals who want this deal put to bed by the end of the month to get one more commission under their belt for the month or quarter.

Some times it like driving a van with 13 kids in the back seat screaming "Are we there yet?????".

When something goes wrong...Well obviously it is that stupid incompetent closer, the company that they work for and the 30,000 other employees working hard for that company and their own individual customers.

I have concluded that we have become a world of quick blame artists and a society of people who have lost the ability to take their own individual share of the responsibility.

Of course, we will never reverse that trend, as long as we have the under paid and overworked closer to blame.

Of course, maybe society has always been that way, all along. Isn't true that Adam tried to place the blame on Eve for his share of the reported first human screw up in the Garden of Eden??? For the non-believers, we can at least agree that the Bible is one of the oldest written historical books and it does a outstanding job of reflecting real personalities that we can recognize in the people living during the period of it's writing.

I have been in the title business for 36 years. It has become a complex and unforgiving world. First American has thousand's of employees, who don't deserve this lynch mob treatment. It is unfortunate, that our society has evolved into a gang of thugs looking for the negative, rather than the positive in people.

Your problem seems to be the rush of the last minute arrival of the lender doc's. The poor closer has multiple persons or individuals with self serving motives rushing and pressurizing her. The funding lender, the lending broker, the processor, the listing agent, the selling agent, the buyer, the seller of the seller’s replacement home and the agents connected with that deal. This transaction suddenly becomes the domino for a multiple of other transactions pending filled with individual agenda's and demands on this one closer. Of course, don't forget those professionals who want this deal put to bed by the end of the month to get one more commission under their belt for the month or quarter.

Some times it like driving a van with 13 kids in the back seat screaming "Are we there yet?????".

When something goes wrong...Well obviously it is that stupid incompetent closer, the company that they work for and the 30,000 other employees working hard for that company and their own individual customers.

I have concluded that we have become a world of quick blame artists and a society of people who have lost the ability to take their own individual share of the responsibility.

Of course, we will never reverse that trend, as long as we have the under paid and overworked closer to blame.

Of course, maybe society has always been that way, all along. Isn't true that Adam tried to place the blame on Eve for his share of the reported first human screw up in the Garden of Eden??? For the non-believers, we can at least agree that the Bible is one of the oldest written historical books and it does a outstanding job of reflecting real personalities that we can recognize in the people living during the period of it's writing.

Hello,
Well, for now it's hard to fight First American Title Company but there day will come in court. Please listen to the story then could can decide since my story is in my opinion (IMHO) not theres.
I would like to warn you about their incompetence. I only wish I had seen this site before I used them.

Here the story. They had to do a quit claim title for me and screwed up. No title insurance was taken out because it was only a recording. The Nation office in NY reviewed the will and recorded the title in Florida. Not only was the quit claim title done incorrectly they also did not follow Florida law for estate divisions.
They have a slippery team of lawyers who will force you to take them to court. In fact they have a relationship with the past lawyer so neither the laywer or FAT will take the blame.
Here's the BEST. Guess who rejected the current title when I went to sell the property, First American Title. They actually rejected their original title. Guess that's not addmitting your mistake.
My advise is don't even use them to record someting because if it's done wrong it's your resposibility.
Do use them because they will review papers and then issue you a title which could be wrong or not done according to various states laws on "real property". Basic they have caused me alot of heartship over this issue.
They will have there day in court in NY NJ and Florida.
Plan and simple, if you are smart enough to read this advise others that there no good.
Look even when I have the paper trail of their incompetence their lawyers don't what to admit anything went wrong.
See you in Court FAT asses.

Oh g-d...I am in the process of "closing" a simple real estate deal in Joshua Tree - no lender involved...and I chose to go to Frist American...big mistake. This 30-day escrow has taken almost 90 days...the agent is always "very busy, too much backed-up paperwork, will get to our file, makes mistakes, which I correct, and the mistakes show up again..." I am disgusted and will never use this company again. I found this website while just beginning to look for the company's directory to see who I will complain to, when it's all over...I wish I'd read the comments on this site before going to First American. BD

We have been trying to close with the usless help of FATCO for 2 weeks now. There was a signature missing at first. Then figures were incorrect (fault of our Mort. Broker), however since they had the paperwork for sometime, I would have thought this would have been caught sooner. Then they were missing documents from our home owners insurance policy. Then there was some other form they forgot to have us sign. All while we had rented out our home we live in, and have to children and are living on a mattress in the empty old house, and working and trying to fix up the old house for our tenant. Finally when the title company had all the paperwork, they were supposed to Fed EX it to the lender on a specific day - they even went so far as to say they had done it. When in reality, 3 days later, the lender said they barely got it that morning. Had it been sent on the day FATCO said they sent it, the lender would have had the documents 2 days earlier. Since the lender is on the East Coast, and we are on the West Coast, this makes the problem of the paperwork not being sent as promised, even worse.

Ok, now its Friday, and Monday is a holiday, and they just recieved the paperwork. The lender will not fund the loan prior to 48 hours of receiving the documents. This means the earliest we could get funded is Wednesday, since Mon. is a holiday and Tues. makes the 48 business hours they need to have the paperwork. Of course, there was another document missing, forgotton, missed? Well, now my husband has that faxed to his work, signs it and FATCO has a courier pick it up (by 11am) and sent back to FATCO. They were then supposed to FED EX it to the lender. It is now Wednesday 10am and just as I suspected, FATCO did not FED EX the paper out yesterday. They claim it got to the office after thier FED EX guy already left. We have to stay in a hotel now (difficult with a 2 year old and a teenager) because I doubt the paper had been "picked up" by the FED EX guy even as we speak. It will go out today, and possible get to the lender tomorrow (at end of thier day because of the time difference), which will mean they won't see it until Friday, and then (does that mean they have to have it another 48 hours?) Maybe, we will get our keys next week. A full 3 weeks later. Oh, and my lender disclosed terms of my loan to my builder. Is there something legally I can do about that? The builder was talking to me like I was some criminal just because she knew about my loan having conditions on it... By the way, I would call FATCO and get one answer and then call them a few hours later and get a conflicting answer. My broker and husband would call and get different answers also, all in the same hour. They did lie about Fed Ex'ing the paperwork on a specific day, and did forget several key papers that needed signing the first time, had that not happened... well, we can not speculate can we?
My 2 year old got the stomach flu and so did I and we packed all our clothes, cant access them, so we had to go and buy clothes to wear just to tide us over. They need to be more careful about making sure all the paperwork is there before having someone sign. They need to send paperwork out in a timely fashion and not lie about sending it out. I used Nevada Title last time, and they were wonderful!

So I have a little info for you next time you go buy a house. If you go through a listing or selling agent you dont get to pick a title company, it's the company that holds the Deed of Trust. The Deed of Trust is the document that tells people how much you owe on a house. When you look on your deed of trust it will usually say somthing like Grantor (your name here) Grantee ex. First American Title, Stuart Title, (and if the Trustor/grantor is a lender then the lender picks for you.) Sorry but there are things in this life you cannot stop, forces and things that drive you ahead not matter what. Plus, your basing your opinions on one bad expereince. That is pretty simple minded if you ask me...

How can I ask you? You've not identified yourself.

I've been in the Escrow Industry for 21 years. There is much confusion on the part of the Buyers, Sellers and even Realtors on what the true function of Escrow is, and what we can and cannot control. Although some of these postings do indicate a lack of care, or sheer overwhelming volume of work assigned to individuals, much of this 'blame' being placed on escrow is misdirected. I stumbled on this very good article that clearly defines the responsibilities of your Escrow Agent. It is located at http://www.realestateabc.com/homeguide/Escrow.htm If you are truly interested, it is worth a few moments of your time. Although it is based on CA, I find it applies equally well in AZ (where I practice).

So, has anyone noticed that WA Mutual has been getting it's hold on a few assets that aren't theirs? If anyone out there feels the same, let me know. I need all the help I can get against these f***** as****** ! Thanks
Bonnie

Just an update on the issue I'm having with
FATCO. They deny that they did anything wrong.
Now the estate lawyer and Fatco have a relationship with each other and have stonewalled me good. IMO they are just covering eachother because they know they were both Incompetent.
Do not allow FATCO to review any Wills and allow them to record any quit claim title. They will not take any responsibility if the law was not followed correctly or if they make a mistake.
Do not use this company. They are the worst.

Just wanted anyone who got screwed by this company to take notice. Look at Arizona. I'm not surprised because I suspected this in NY too.
You get yours with the NY division of consumer affairs real soon.IMO

http://www.azcentral.com/arizonarepublic/business/articles/0427reinsurance27.html

Jeremy,

I am sorry you had a bad experience with First American Title. I am a loan officer in Arizona and I had an incident with my borrower at the signing. Title companies are regulated by State Banking in Arizona and all real estate, mortgage, title companies are government regulated. Try www.hud.gov/compliants

Hope this helps!

I have used First American Title several times throughout my home ownership life and have had no problems. First And foremost I want to say that the Closing process does not come "error" free. That is why the buyer needs to look atand ask questions before he signs a document. We are all human, and in line with that "mistakes will be made" and not just by Fatco. It would be safe to say that Fidelity Title or any other Title company for that matter have made some of the same mistakes that everyone seems to be bad mouthing Fatco for here. It all comes down to the lender and broker in making sure that everything gets communicated well in advance of the closing. If the lender waits till the last minute before sending changes to escrow then expect some mistakes to come out of it. It happens in every Industry, not just title. It all come down to Communication! Communication! COMMUNICATION! Shame on the lender for not giving them more notice to prepare before you sign on the dotted line. How does the saying go! "The lack of preparation on the lenders part should not automatically become a sense of urgency on Titles". In my opinion Title People are the ones that work the hardest for there money. "Remember! to ward off confusion, one must communicate first" and that is everyones job.

For "FATCO Employee" who wrote on June 9 that the Grantor is the title co or lender (huh?) and that's who chooses the title company if the buyer goes through a real estate agent to buy a home. Huh? The only debate about who chooses is whether it's the buyer or seller. Most in the industry believe the buyer chooses, but some think RESPA may be interpreted so it allows either to choose. It's certainly not the former title company or the lender! As for all the complaints about FATCO, like most companies, it all depends on the individual. Ask your real estate agent or lender for a referral. They usually have one or two they trust. This thread probably could have been started for any large title company and had the same comments and complaints. However, I have to say to the FATCO employees posting here, you're not making a good impression for the company. You should NEVER blast any customer, and you shouldn't post when you don't know what you're talking about. Maybe you should get back to your files and spend your time taking care of customers. Even if a reader takes this thread with a grain of salt, they'd be totally turned off by the attitude of some of the FATCO employees posting here.

A notary public is now required BY LAW to get your thumbprint to notarize your signature. As far as the documents every single one of those documents are from the MORTGAGE COMPANY-the title company is the middle man they're not giving you the loan and they're selling you the house they are the middle party. As far as the mistake on your Hud-1 IT WAS A MISTAKE, give the girl a break, you act as if you've never made a mistake. If you were as rude as you sound by printing your letter on the sight, you intimidated her and made her flustered. We escrow officers can tell what kind of a sign-off its going to be as soon as you walk in the door.

I worked for First American many years ago. They are a good title company but also suffer from the same problems that other title companies nationwide suffer from, the lack of competent employees. The problem is that as the refi boom and now the real estate boom are on, the title companies are hard pressed to keep up and are forced to hire ANYBODY with even a smidgeon of experience. Therefore, you end up with a very junior escrow officer in a senior escrow officer position. The problem is not unique to First American Title.
Also, in response to one individuals comments regarding Santa Clara County where a seller picks the title insurer, that in and of itself is illegal. It is a violation of the Real Estate Settlement Procedures Act (RESPA), Section Nine which states that the buyer must be given the choice of title company

If anyone has any questions, I am a licensed broker (real estate and mortgage) in six states, California, Nevada, Utah, Colorado, Montana and Idaho. My email address is johnrunkle@aol.com

I just turned victim today, Oct. 14, 2005 by incompetence of an escrow officer at First American Title, City of Roseville, CA. The escrow officer never informed me of the closing cost amount not until a couple of hours prior the closing appointment. Everyone makes mistake but it would not have been bad if one can prudently admit making the mistake.

This site cracks me up. We started a title company because 95% of title companies suck. They are understaffed, unprofessional and unappreciative of their clients. I loved hearing everybodys comments, especially the agents who are trying to help/get a lead out of this.

On your next closing, get a recommendation from a reputable lender, not just a guy who does a lot of business. Key phrase, reputable.

When we bought our home, our closing went great but
the hillbillys didn't move out. We showed up and they hadn't packed yet. Nothing like having the police evict the trash when you work hard to buy a home.

Best of luck in the future.

I think it's interesting that people are coming to this website and thinking they have a full and complete understanding of FATCO, which is a company of 30,000+ employees. Certainly, there are incompetent Escrow Officers, but to echo the comments of several other respondents, it's more often the lender that screws up closings than the escrow officer. It's absolutely true that more often than not, officers are waiting for docs from the lender as you wait in the lobby. Who's feeling the heat more? A lender who can put the escrow officer into voice mail or the officer who's sitting there figuring out the worthless proprietary software to view and print lender docs with you in the lobby fuming?

The best officers will be adept in dealing with this pressure, but it doesn't change the nature of the problem in the original (and several subsequent posts): blame your lender. FATCO docs are not redundant; they consist of escrow instructions (allowing us to do our job), an estimated HUD, proceeds authorization (allowing you to get your money), and any random other doc that might be required for your transaction to go through: a warranty deed, etc. That's like 5 signatures out of 50 and all for distinct purposes.

Blame your lender, not the neutral third party who simply complies with lender instructions (and occasionally transposes a number under the heat of a time limit they cannot control).

But most of all, do not take the opinions of maybe 50 people who've had bad escrow experiences at FATCO as an accurate representation of the whole company. Fifty closings would represent one officer's closings in one branch for one month, if that. I'm pretty confident that there are many more satisfied FATCO customers out there than those like yourselves, else we wouldn't still be around, nor would we have repeat buyers, sellers, agents as customers, would we?

INTERESTING STUFF YOU HAVE HERE...Had to put in my two cents worth after reading this blog. I'm a realtor in Houston and I've experienced both good and bad service dealing with lenders, title companies, and vendors. Finding a reputable title or abstract company and escrow office is like finding a needle in a haystack. If you are fortunate enough to establish working relationships with such folks, do so! Their jobs are crazy at best! They are the unsung heros of a home sale. Without them, nothing would get done.

I make it a point to send a detailed 'checklist' with every listing agreement/contract when opening title, and regularly follow up on matters. Anal, yes...surprised, no. Preventive measures ensure smooth closings. Title company staff have way too many files to prepare, are understaffed, and the sheer enormity of the volumne of closings is unreal. The biggest culpret is the desire to have most of your 'closings' on the last day of the month to avoid additional interest charges. What a crock!! Who thought that up? Some penny-pinching accountant? Be smart pay the extra interest and close the 1st or 2nd week of the month. It is worth it. It's common sense: if clerical workers are overstressed and understaffed, they are prone to making more mathmatical errors. Have several people recheck figures. Don't assume anything. It's very rare for a HUD-1 Settlement Statement or lender paperwork NOT to have an error on it or some other paperwork snapfu. People are going to hate me for saying this, "Most of the problems come from bankers/lenders, who submit documents late, incomplete, and with no real directions or guidance. Communication is poor or conflicting at best of exactly what is meant. Just ask about pre-qual vs. pre-approval letters and you'll understand. There's no standardization!! Banks pay their people horrible wages (the people on the frontline dealing with the public). Unless you are a VP."

One of the biggest problems is when people list properties for sale initially, they don't do 'their homework' of possible issues that could effect transfer of title. Have enough brains to ask marriage status (Can you prove it? Got a certified copy of a divorce decree? Community property state issues - who owns it legally?); physically see a copy of the Deed of Trust or Warranty; ASK about everything. Such as power of attorneys (elderly), outstanding mortgage amount, home equity loans, pending lawsuits (HOA/POA), vendor liens, survey issues/boundaries, etc. If you ask this info before the property is put up for sale, you can eliminate most of the issues that could prevent a sale later. A biggie: any outstanding taxes paid, received, and publicly recorded prior to a new deed of ownership being submitted for recording? Just remember this: for someone to do 'their job' someone else has to do 'theirs' first. The whole system is based on a string of legal research and verification. If just one person is out sick, the process stops until they return. Treat your escrow officers/processors like gold. Feed them chocolate regularly! It's not their fault they get 'crap in' and are expected to turn around a pile of incomplete documents like some wizard of oz character. The issue really is about doing the job 'right' the first time. Stop passing the buck and be responsible. Whatever party you are to a transaction, you have a vested interest in doing a quality job. Note, I said: QUALITY not quantity. Enough said. Walk a mile in their shoes, then you'll have something to talk about! What you put into it, is what you get out of it.

--Karen Savage, Realtor, KW/CONROE 1/26/6

I am having trouble with First American at this very time. I have a large judgment lien that I filed prior to the sale of property owned by the debtor in Chelan County. They were going through First American in Wenatchee.
I contacted First American prior to the closing of the property to make sure they knew of the lien on the property. The sale would have resulted in the payment of my judgment. They slipped in an exception on the title report that excluded my judgment on the title insurance.
The result: The debtor was paid the entire sum and my judgment went unpaid. What I have now is a lien on property of an innocent person not involved in the damages I received the judgment for. They protected themselves by excluding my judgment but they screwed the buyer because I now have a lien on his property. If I file a writ of execution on the property I am basically screwing someone that while a little ignorant should not have to pay my judgment. The law says I can force him to pay the seller's debt or force the sale of his house.
How is this fair? I do not want to have the sheriff seize someone's house that probably signed the paper along with a hundred other documents required in a sale.
They didn't get any better deal in buying the house with my lien. They were not duly informed of the consequences of this paper basically putting their home at risk.

I was incompetently served and improperly treated by First American Title Company.

On March 21, 2001, I made a $35,000 Second Mortgage loan.
The Title Insurance Policy showed no liens.

The mortgagor defaulted, and I was forced to foreclose. The title search revealed that:
The property had a SUPERIOR IRS TAX LIEN OF $1,995,391 ..... An outrageous error!

My attorney made a claim and received a totally defensive response. FATCO's attorney even summoned ME for a recorded deposition as if I had done something improper.

The IRS lien became an impossible obstacle for me in recovering my loss.

1. If the property was sold at the First Mortgage foreclosure sale, I would receive none of the "overage" because it would go to IRS.

2. After I obtained title to the property by paying off the First Mortgage, No one (including FATCO) would issue title insurance on the property, so that I could sell the property and recover my investment.

After months of difficulties, thousands of dollars, and the death of my attorney; FATCO settled my claim for $3,500 because I could not afford more attorney fees.

I have read almost all the emails about FATCO...true there are no excuses for crappy services. I am curious as to why when people invest in new or resold homes do you not do followup with your agent regularly to ensure that any issues you are concerned with during your transactions are not brought to his attention. As a Broker I assume the responsibility for being totally involved in my clients transaction and they are not even required to call me often to do follow up. I call them and alert them to any errors or posible land mines that may be coming their way. Title companies are completely responsible for the final package being correct. I know this and I stay in touch constantly to track the package. There are many incompetent title folks out there due to the amazing sale, resale and refi market that we've experienced in the last 10 years. It's just as bad for real estate offices with incompetent sales people that are nothing more than glorified order takers ina booming real estate market. The point is the buck stops with me and I have always insisted on the clients rights and their right to be treated fairly and for you to do your job. Therefore when I hear storie liek this the question should be asked who is responsible for what is happening to the client...a simple answer is in the DRE code..."a fiduciary obligation to the client"! Therefore I urge all agents to track what is going on with their client and be proactive in their transaction at all levels and you will have a satisfied client and ensure that escrow and title are doing their job just as you should be doing yours to ensure the comfort of your clients experience.

Landrus Clark, Broker

Just as a Follow up from my post on November 16, 2004 10:44 PM. After talking with a Lawyer Dean Cloud out of Glendale who works for FATCO. These people make mistakes and go after the small guys for the money. PLEASE DO NOT TRUST THIS COMPANY. Yes people make mistakes! But as humans we need to own up to our mistakes which FATCO does NOT do at all. I finally paid these people off and the only things Dean CLOUD out of Glendale CA FATCO office can do is call me names. Yes that is correct a Lawyer for FATCO swearing at me and calling me names. All the FATCO employees who read this and reply who try to defend these actions should really take a hard look at who they work for. Are all Title company's bad ? NO. Do I recomend any? NO. I am not in the industry at all. Just one of the people who got taken for $3500. by FATCO and their mistakes. FYI Great Blog keep up the good work. FATCO Lawyers told me they really hate sites like this. :)

Hi FATCO paid off the wrong loan.....
Now we have late fees
They can't read an address on payoff demand!
Lori

Fatco held my escrow , I got into a dispute with the builder, Fatco knowing I was in litigation, secretly allowed the seller to open a second escrow for the same property, did not disclose this to me, I thought I was still in escrow, they still have my deposit, and they closed to the other party which was the client of the big builder who offered to pay more, $135,000 more for the property.

I am an experienced home owner, a mortgage closing professional, title escrow/closing officer and generally nice human being. After reading Jeremy's piece on First American and his experience I have to post a comment. First of all, I am sorry for his bad experience. There are more stories out there about good closing experiences, but who takes time to post those? Everyone who has a bad experience about something talks about that--- its like the evening news, more entertaining to hear about something bad than good. However, having been in the mortgage and title business for the past 13 years I've seen both sides of what goes on and I can promise you this---it is almost ALWAYS the lender who screws up. Period. The title company takes the blame for everything and our job is to take the crap and make the realtors and lenders and brokers look good. For the work that we do what we charge is NOTHING. Have an attorney do the same work and you'd be charged double or more. We work our fannies off to get the job done, so much goes on behind the scenes the average consumer would not believe it. The lenders make tons of errors, get us closing documents that are incorrect, come at the last minute, and don't even bother to show up at the closings (assuming they are even LOCAL). They charge fees that are total b.s. (admittedly not all, but a lot of them have garbage fees) and we sit at the closing table, eye to eye with the consumer, who then thinks they are OUR documents and OUR fees. The consumer comes to the closing unaware of SO much, like this Jeremy who says the paper was off from their estimate. Jeremy--that was your LENDER'S "Good Faith Estimate" and your LENDER has the responsiblity by LAW to make it within a certain dollar amount "tolerance". Let me ask you THIS------why did you select this LENDER? So many consumers are GREEDY----they select a lender based solely on the interest rate, not taking into account WHO this PERSON is, who the COMPANY is, if they have any INTEGRITY. Sometimes I have to say I truly feel sorry for people who come to the closings uneducated about the process and who have clearly been HOSED, other times the consumer is ARROGANT and GREEDY and I can honestly say that my Christian values are nearly set aside as I watch you get HOSED financially because of your selfish greed! The bottom line is that the title company may have made an error, and if they did they had a responsiblity to step up and correct it, but your LENDER was who was supposed to tell YOU what to bring to your closing. So, you should have been PREPARED by your lender and yes, the title company representative should have gotten the necessary documents from you at closing.

You ought to become a better informed, better educated consumer next time you make a home purchase. Having worked for several title company underwriters, incluing Land America, Transnation, Stewart Title and First American, I can honestly say that of all the companies, First American was the best, at least in my personal experience. They are a company of integrity and value honesty. I believe that if you brought this issue to the attention of the management of your title office they would have done their best to rectify the situation.

Best of luck in your next home purchase; I sincerely hope your next experience is a better one, and you can come to my office in Michigan if you want a truly professional closing experience!

This is a follow up to my previous post. I notice that all the people that are "in the business" are blaming the mortgage brokers and loan officers for title's last second receipt of the loan documents. Having done title, escrow, owning a mortgage company and six real estate offices, I can only refer to a remark I read in a Realtor magazine some years ago.

The Real Estate Commissioner at the time (I believe it was Jim Antt) was asked what he would most like to see improve in the real estate field. He responded by stating that he would like to see the streamlining of mortgages a priority. His reasoning was that he could walk into a Mercedes Benz dealership and walk out an hour later with a $120,000 vehicle. However, if he wanted to buy a $45,000 condo it would take 45 days.

The problem is not with the mortgage brokers or loan officers in most cases. Although I must admit I have run into my share of incompetence in both the mortgage and real estate fields. However, most loans take a minimum of 30 days to complete. If you run into any problems, tack another two weeks onto it. The brokers are at the mercy of the appraisers (sometimes two weeks) and the underwriters (another 3 or 4 days) and that is assuming everything goes as planned.

It would be wise to plan for a delay in your closing. It happens more often than not and then you are not disappointed. I always counseled my seller's and buyers to expect delays and problems. Virtually every transaction has its problems and the best you can do is try to minimize them. Even the best of the best Realtor cannot make things disappear but they can assist in minimizing the effect on your transaction.

Hi Jeremy,
Sorry to hear your purchase was an ordeal. Part of the problem is that you weren't aware of the duties each of the 20-26 people involved in the transaction were responsible for. That isn't your fault, that is your real estate agent's fault, part of their job is to educate you about the intricate and complex process of buying or selling property. You are blaming the title company for escrow issues and blaming the escrow company for lender issues(a billion documents), etc.
BTW, I don't work for First American Title.
dj

I have a lien on a house that was sold. The seller and debtor used FATCO. When I was not paid and FATCO would not talk to me I made a complaint to the attorney general. They wrote back that this was not a problem they dealt with but they sent me back several papers FATCO had sent them in response to my complaint. One of these was a letter from the debtor's attorney telling them not to pay the judgment and that the debtor indemnifies them against any action by me. How is this so? I plan to file suit as soon as I get an attorney.
How does indemnifying them against any action against me allow them not to pay the lien? The lien is valid and properly filed while the debtor owned the property.

I have been involved in Real Estate for more than 20 years. I prefer to use First American Title when my clients are willing and have no preference. My experience has been that when things are screwed up, 99.9% of the time, it is the lending company who has done it. Every deal I have ever "lost" has been because of the lending company, never the title company.

Unfortunately, as a VP of an un-named Title Company, the being read to and told where to sign that frustrated you, is absolutely necessary. The problem is that consumers take advantage of the idea of lawsuit when not walked through or having their hands held. I have seen many a case where Title Companies, especially mom and pop title companies, are put under because of the old "I didn't know what I was signing" or "You should not have assumed I knew what I was doing". As for the missing documentation, no excuses, It sounds as if you had an unexperienced closer. Congrats on the House! By the way, California does not require fingerprinting for a closing, not sure why they would do that....Have a great day.

We purchased a home in January 2005. In March 2006, we received a bill from the city for past due amount of $8000 for a sewer assessment. The previous owner never made a payment. We paid for an owners title policy through First American. This had been recorded a number of years prior to us purchasing property. We have written numerous times to the claims department without any luck. We also have written to the VP in their Mo. office. Can anyone offer help? Thanks

For Tim 7/19/06 comment. Contact your State's Insurance Commissioner. You can file a complaint but more than likely they will just tell you who to talk to to get the issue resolved.

I am a former Fatco employee. I purchased a home while working for them and there was a lien missed. The lien was from the neighbor behind me and was for the maintenance of a shared road. The maintenance agreement is clearly on record as is the lien for $12,000, which represented over 20 years of upkeep that the former owner of my house refused to participate in. The neighbor came to meet me when we moved in, and as a lovely welcome gift he told me about the lien. I asked him why he didn't tell the agent who had the sign in front of the house and he just shrugged. He wrote a letter to Fatco demanding payment and they told him that the lien carried a faulty legal description, though it is a legal and binding lien. Fatco won't pay him and now I am trying to refi out of a variable rate mortgage and they are ignoring me, though the lien is in first position ahead of my current lender, and I have an owner's policy that does not show the lien.

I am not new at this, and there is a reason I do not work for them anymore. They have outsourced much of the examining to Manila and India, and the quality is the pits. My exam was done in Manila and obviously it was not done correctly. I left after seeing them summarily dismiss long-time examiners to up their profits, while at the same time posting multi-billion dollar profits. Their management is incompetent and selfish. Much of their escrow processing is now done in Mexico.

I hate them, I really really do. If you want to read something more about what they are willing to do to people in order to avoid paying on claims, read this book by Louis Declazio:

http://heavenlyvisitation.org/Store/scripts/prodView.asp?idproduct=30

He lost his life savings and First American Title helped his partner commit fraud to bilk him out of everything.

I am a notary and work for many signing services and escrow offices (although have not done anything for First American yet). I am sorry for your experience. I sheds a bad light on the Notary profession, however, maybe I can offer some incite and advice for your next loan signing experience.

First, Be picky about the notary. Make sure s/he is a Certified Notary Signing agent with at least 3 years experience. The fact is, many of these signing services will take any notary that can fog a mirror. If you request someone with experience, that person can explain a document's function without interpreting the legalese. S/he is used to the process and will notice if something is missing in most cases and can catch and corrent for errors (like a $4,500 appraisal fee) before the appointment even happens. He or she would also be able to explain that a thumbprint is REQUIRED for any notarization involving a deed of trust in the state of California.

Second, educate yourself on what are standard fee ranges and what is just plain "BS Nickel and Diming." The standard notary fee for a complete loan signing is $150. Often times the notary has to split a large portion of that to the company that hired him or her, leaving the notary with $50-$65. If there is an addition loan in your package, it is common to charge half of the base fee for each additional loan. Thus, A first loan with a Home Equity Line of Credit should cost $225 ($150 + $75) for the Notary services. An appraisal on a residential house with no extreme circumstances should never be more than $400 (usually around $350 or less). An origination fee is nothing but upfront profit for the sales office that sold you the loan. You can avoid that fee by shoping direct with the lenders, avoid brokers, but you may have to sign a pre-payment rider to guarantee that they will make a profit on your loan at some point. They don't want to spend $1000's in resources underwriting and processing your loan only to have you refi in 6 months, before they have had a chance to make a profit on the interest of your loan.

Lastly, don't be afraid to call your lender contact the day before the signing and verify the following:
-Are there any changes in the closing costs since we last spoke? What form of payment is required? (often if the amount due from borrower is less than $500, they will accept a personal check)
-Are there any required documents I need to provide to the Notary at the signing?
-Is there a right of rescission document in the package?... This gives you a few days to review the docs, ask any questions, and if necessary back out of the loan at no cost to you (accept the appraisal fee). This is critical because the notary is not allowed to answer certain types of questions. Specific questions about fees and terms must be directed to the lender or the escrow officer. This document is required for refi's on primary residences in CA, but not required for new home purchases or investment property. If your package does not have a Right to Cancel/Rescission doc, make sure your signing is during business hours and you have your lender's phone number handy so you can get important questions answered.

I hope that this info is helpful to all who read it.

Sincerely,

Jeff Harrel
Certified Notary Signing Agent
Riverside County, CA

You're an idiot... i'm referring to the First American Title article in which you pretty much run an escrow officer into the ground for no reason.

1. Notaries in the state of California are required by law to obtain your fingerprint in order to prevent identity fraud (amazing, this fraud really DOES happen and people try to sell properties that are not their own.) You can refer to the Patriot Act passed by the Federal Government regarding this.

2. Notaries, by law in the State of California, are allowed to charge $10.00 per signature notarized. $40.00 you got off easy. Some loan packages have 8-10 documents which require a notary, and if you are married you'd be looking at a minimum of $120.00 for a double loan package which is so common these days.

3. Oh about that check, you mentioned it was $4k more than what you were told. Told by whom? Your MORTGAGE BROKER in his good-faith estimate? All that is honey, is an ESTIMATE. 9 times out of 10 the mortgage broker does not estimate escrow/title fees correctly, or they misrepresent other costs/charges, and then it comes down to escrow who then gets to pick up the pieces and "splain" reality as opposed to the previous estimate you received. I don't think in the last 3 yrs, I've seen a GFE anywhere close to being correct.

4. Are you perfect? Do you never make an error in your work or your daily life? Then why do you expect others to be?

Let me tell you about drawing an escrow. An escrow officer might get 5-10 loan packages at once, the customers demand the instructions be drawn and signed within VERY unreasonable time frames in most cases.

The escrow person is forced to prepare documents so quickly that it very often leaves too much room for error. and again. escrow officers are not perfect.

When a loan package is signed, it is not the escrow officer's job to explain each and every document to you, as this puts them into the realm of practicing law without a license. so based on how the customer receives them, will pretty much earmark how the signing will go.

if they ask questions, yes, if possible, we answer. but we are not lenders, and we do not always know the answers.

once a package is signed, the notary completes his/her job, then it takes approx 30 min or so (without any interruptions) to make the necessary copies and return the package to the lender.

The lender then takes 24-48 hours to review this package, and then issue to escrow it's "funding conditions". This can range from needing nothing at all, to needing further documents, further copies of identification (because of the Patriot Act), etc.

Once the lender is happy, the loan gets funded and escrow records once all is in order.

Get it now?

Escrow has historically been the "fall guy" the "bad guy" because escrow is the main contact, the man-in-the-middle. When things go wrong, it's always "escrow's fault", and 90% of the time, it's NOT escrow's fault. In most cases, it's the MORTGAGE BROKER who has not done his/her job, thus delaying the loan closing.

So, Jeremy, get off your high horse and do a little bit of research before you go off half-cocked and flame a job that you know NOTHING about.

And I'd hope that you are just as perfect as you expect everyone else to be.... must be nice to be flawless in this world of imperfection....

These people are only human. You sign a document that states if there are any errors that you agree, by signing, that you will work with them to correct it. None of you evidentally, ever make mistakes at work.

I understand that everyone makes mistakes, hey it may happen in my own career, but everyone needs to own up to it and resolve as quickly as possible. I live next to my grandmom who was told she was dying. She had made a sales agreement with me,to buy house we will call #1. she lived in house #2. My deed transfer for house #1 was handled by my attorney (still unknown to me why was not recordrd immed.?) Grandmom decided to do one of those reverse mort. for house #2. I didn't help with her loan, She already had that set up and family help. I went on with life as a new homeowner. Grandmom died pass 1 yr. later. Grandmom house needed to be sold to satisfy reverse mort.. I stepped up to bat because know I needed a bigger house(I now own 1br free and clear) I married and have now a daughter though she wasn't born when mess started.House # 2 is 4 bdrs, larger lot inside and out. My loan co advised after looking into matters, he loved to help me, but i needed lawyer instead. Mort. co put lien on my house# 1. Almost 18 mos. later and all i get is finger pointing, expensive fee,sleepless nights reasearching, tons of family squabble. It took me 6 mos to get case info. on loan since I didn't assume or even know about a loan( which I never heard of this mort. co til now,thier names cocide w/potty mouth on daily basis in my own home with 160,000. lien. Even the appraiser who was hired by MC, sketched house#2 and photographed,all 4 bed,den lr kit bath 2 bay gar. but he used house # 1 parcel id #, lot size outside & inside. He used the yr built on # 2 and recored several defects #2 property, even came back to take pics of repairs. a couple of first american employee did have flags go up, but did nothing, but maybe try to coss out a couple things, without telling anyone or should demanded a do over????? i mad now over a honest mistake, frustrated beyond belief, because opposing lawyerS treating me as i am the one who trying to pull off a cover up, I hope they read this and realize their delays and counter whatevers effects real families, and now i see i am not he only one complaing. What a crime.

This is all very interesting. Have you heard about the new FATIC product TitleSmart? You're discussion thus far reveals normal business as usual in the title/real estate/mortgage lending world. Humans make mistakes, humans must correct mistakes and you need owner title coverage. Some people are careful, some people are not. You should shop for competent title agents.

Just imagine a world in which there is no good search done on title, maybe even the wrong properties get conveyed or mortgaged. If you think what you've described here is bad, consider having discussion about title corrections with someone from India.

I am a Sr. Escrow Officer and LPO in the state of Washington. I am liscensed by the Washington State Bar Association. I have been closing for 10 years. It is very clear that your Escrow Officer made a human error. It is our job to take instructions from the lender and the Realtor(s). If we are given the wrong information, that information will be passed on to you. Also, with the low cost of escrow fees, we are required to close 50-60 transactions a month. This means we work very long hours and are put under tremendous stress to get your transactions closed. The documents you were required to bring back to the Escrow Officer were papers your Loan Officer was required to obtain from you, not your Escrow Officer. Those are called "BROKER CONDITIONS". By law, we can not be Escrow Officer's and Broker's so I am sure she did not act as your Loan Officer. Your Loan Officer should have requested those forms, not her. We require NO documentation to close except for a photo ID. In fact, her asking you to bring in the paperwork to HER was a favor for the Loan Officer and you. She went above and beyond on that one. You should really allow PEOPLE to be human. We all make mistakes and have bad days. California notaries are required by law to take your fingerprint at the time of signing. You should educate yourself before you start pointing the finger at PEOPLE.

I also just had a bad experience with a FATCO officer here in Washington. We were refinancing and as we were signing the paperwork, she stated that the only thing we were waiting on was the pay-off figure from the current mortgage company. This was Monday afternoon. My husband and I were going out of town the next Sunday for a week and she assured us that everything would be done on Friday before we left. She said that if they hadn't received the pay-off figure on Wednesday, she would give us a call and we would figure it out from there.

Wednesday passed - no call. Thursday went by, no call. My husband decided to check late Thursday afternoon just to make sure everything was a go for the next day, as promised. After all, we hadn't heard anything, so it should be fine. Wrong. They still had not received the pay-off amount and they were just about to close. I didn't find out until after they'd closed.

Friday morning, I called and talk to the officer. She did apologize, but only with excuses - she was out in the field on Wednesday, she wasn't in the office. Did she not have a cell phone to check to see if the figure had arrived? Or at the very least, could she not call us on Thursday? I mean, she's the one that set that schedule. Originally, I didn't think things were going to be ready until we returned from our vacation, until she told us otherwise. I kept wanting a to be told what we were going to do from there (Were we going to wait until we got back? Did I have to pay something on my credit card bills that were due while we were going to be gone?) and instead I got "How many times do I have to apologize to you?" Once sincerely and then letting me know what we were going to do now would have been great. And she was still insisting that it would be done that day, and to bring her the paperwork from when we purchased the house.

It turned out that the current mortgage company wanted papers from the purchase that the title company said they'd never had a mortgage company ask for. My husband went from work to the house to get the papers and then took them to FATCO, but our officer wasn't there! To make sure everything got done that day, my husband sat down at a empty desk with a phone at their office (at least the branch manager apologized, even though she kind of put him to work), and he stayed there for three hours on the phone with mortgage company until the pay-off amount was faxed over! He didn't get back to his own business until almost 4 that afternoon.

When we bought the house, the morgage broker was a nightmare and the title company agent was great. This time, the mortgage broker was great and the title company officer left a lot to be desired. And before you say she was probably new, she said she'd been doing this for 8 years. I don't know for sure, but I'm guessing she's burned out.

Jeremy, thanks for starting this. I do feel a little better after venting!

The following is in response to the message posted by Sparky/Jerry on February 16, 2006. I am the attorney Sparky referred to in his post. I hate to confuse the issues with facts, but the simple facts are that Sparky sold real property to First American’s insured. At the time escrow closed real property taxes that arose during the time Sparky owned the property were not paid. As a result, Sparky received $2,500.00 in excess sales proceeds to which he was not rightfully entitled. Moreover, First American’s insureds wound up taking title subject to real property taxes which were incurred and owed by Sparky. First American’s insured made a claim under their policy of title insurance. To perfect title as insured, First American paid the taxes which were rightfully the responsibility of Sparky.

Under th